Ausgangswelle Ersatz und Fall Schweiß

[manco]

I have recently acquired a good condition 1986 XT600 49N motor with under 9000 original kilometers. The only issue the engine has is that at some point in the motor's life the drive sprocket holder was allowed to wear almost completely away. This caused the drive sprocket to wobble which in turn wore away the splines on the output shaft.

I would like to install this motor into my XT but I must replace the output shaft first. Because the rest of the bottom end of the motor is good I do not think a full dissembled bottom end rebuild is needed. I am wondering if instead I can simply replace the output shaft as follows:

1 remove generator cover & rotor
2 remove top end of motor
3 lay the engine on its right side
4 split the left half of case away
5 swap output shaft
6 reassemble in reverse order

Can someone say will this method work or for some reason must the entire bottom end be torn down?

Also when the sprocket wobbled the chain notched a minor grove into the case. I should like to get this groove welded up. I am wondering what the cases of these 80s XT600 is. Aluminum? or Magnesium?



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from google translate

Ich habe vor kurzem einen guten Zustand 1986 XT600 49N Motor mit unter 9000 Original km erworben. Das einzige Problem ist der Motor an einem gewissen Punkt in der Motor Leben, dass die Antriebsritzel Halter wurde fast vollständig weg zu tragen erlaubt. Dies führte zu dem Antriebszahnrad was wiederum zu wackeln die Keilnuten an der Abtriebswelle trug entfernt.

Ich möchte an dieser Motor in meinem XT zu installieren, aber ich muss die Abtriebswelle zunächst ersetzen. Da der Rest des unteren Endes des Motors gut ist, glaube ich nicht, eine vollständige demon unteren Ende benötigt wird, um wieder aufzubauen. Ich frage mich, wenn stattdessen kann ich einfach die Ausgangswelle wie folgt ersetzen:

1 Entfernen Generatordeckel und Rotor
2 entfernen oberen Ende der Motor
3 lag der Motor auf der rechten Seite
4 teilen die linke Hälfte der Fall entfernt
5 Swap Ausgangswelle
6 Der Zusammenbau erfolgt in umgekehrter Reihenfolge

Kann jemand diese Methode der Arbeit oder aus irgendeinem Grund sagen wird die gesamte untere Ende abgerissen werden müssen?

Auch wenn das Kettenrad wackelte die Kette gekerbt eine untergeordnete Hain in das Gehäuse. Ich möchte diese Nut zu erhalten schweißt. Ich frage mich, was die Fälle dieser 80er XT600 ist. Aluminium? oder Magnesium?

[christian78]

Pictures please...

The german Google translation is... äääh interesting.
Reading the englisch version, i understand more :7

To dissasemble:
- Remove the right and the left cover.
- Remove the generator (tool ist needet!)
- Remove the cover from the head
- Remove the tensioner from the camshaft chain
- Remove camshaft
- Remove head
- Remove cylinder
- Remove piston
- Then the clutch,... and so on.
Then you can start to dissasemble the Gearbox


Its possible to change the old version from the gearshaft to the new one with thinner interlocking. But then you have to change some other parts too. The new version doesnt get this problem.


I guess the material is a mix aluminium magnesium.
Take care of the screw threads!!



LG
Chris

[manco]

This below I do as you say

>- Remove the right and the left cover.
>- Remove the generator (tool ist needet!)
>- Remove the cover from the head
>- Remove the tensioner from the camshaft chain
>- Remove camshaft
>- Remove head
>- Remove cylinder

Then I would stop disassembly and leave in place everything bolted to the right half of the engine case. So all these parts stay in place

piston, crankshaft, primary gears, counter balancer and everything else bolted to the right side of crank case.

Instead I would next place engine on bench and pull only left side of crankcase off to access the gear box. Then I swap the output shaft. Then reassemble in reverse.

I do not see a reason to remove parts from right side of case if all parts are good and the left side will come off and go back on in such a way as to allow the swapping of the output shaft.

I know it sounds like a strange way to only pull the left crankcase side off. It would be nice if it did work as it would save time.

I will be back with pics when I begin to take the motor apart.

[christian78]

Its much easier to let all the stuff in the left side because of the fitting from the crankshaft.
Mostly the sit from the left crankshaft bearing is very strong.
The crankshaft cant go out of its bearing because of the wheel from the camshaft drive.

You can not put out only one of the gearshafts because of the shape an the tools needet to shift (how its called?). So you have to remove both shafts and then you have to remove the primary stuff and clutch too.


I really dont know wether/how its possible to let the stuff in the right side.
But if its possible the time you need for your version to work istn´t really faster then the normal way...
If you assemble like this, probably you got trouble with the left crankshaft bearing.
Moreover you have no chance to put all the stuff at the same time in the right position...
You have to seal the halves together => time to fix is limited.
Wondering if its possible.

In my opinion its much better/easier to do the normal way.

LG
Chris

[manco]

I have been studying parts diagrams. It is true the other shaft will need to be loose. Maybe the shift cam too I have been thinking. Hopefully not. Maybe wiggle room?

The main bearing is as you say in place on the left because of cam chain gear. But this is good as the bearing stay in place and move from the case and return to the case half when put back.

Maybe it will work. Maybe not. I will have nuts loose on the right side in case more parts must come off.

[christian78]

The left bearing ist able to move between the cam chain gear and the crank shaft. It isn´t ensured that the bearing sizes full in the left half like bevore.

You have to assembly the crankshaft with bearing first in the left half (theres an hole in the crankshaft to reach the outer part of the bearing).
The right bearing is mounted bevore in the right half.
While assembly the crankshaft automatikally sticks easy into the left bearing. No force needet.


I recommend you to do it in the normal way. Otherwise you do it two times :7
Whats your mind not to remove the primary stuff? Its no problem.


Clean the oil sieve!
You have to open it carefully.

LG
Chris

[manco]

>I recommend you to do it in the normal way. Otherwise you do
>it two times :7

This is the best advice for sure. Thank you for saying it is so.


>Whats your mind not to remove the primary stuff? Its no
>problem.

What it is is at the beginning I start to research maybe it is possible to leave all in place on right, pull case half, change output shaft and back together so easy. As research progresses it looks less possible to not possible. Too know if it could work is still of interest. If it does not work with other parts already loose it all will be ok the same in the end as the engine must come apart & go back together one way or another. I will see what may be possible as the project progresses. Maybe all will be fine with quicker method if not everything comes apart.

[christian78]

I´ve got a closer look.
If you split the gearbox halves you cannot chose in which halve the stuff remains.

If you insistence upon the parts to remain on the right side, many parts will fall on the ground und you don´t know how the stuff will fit togeher again.
You have no chance to assemble that without removing the primary stuff and the parts on the right side.

I´m sure to 90 percent, nearly :7

[manco]

>If you insistence upon the parts to remain on the right side,
>many parts will fall on the ground

Actually I am fairly confident that the opposite would happen if the parts stayed connected to the right side & cases where split. What would occur is that the transmission shafts, forks & shift cam would be locked in place. How this occurs is this: The main axle is bolted to the right, the shift cam is bolted to the right, the shift forks and drive axle (output shaft) are not bolted in place. Instead of bolts the drive axle & shift forks float in between the cases being held in place by the main axle, shift cam and bearings. How this occurs is the meshing of the gears, forks and shift cam all hold the loose parts together because the primary axle & shift cam are bolted in place & there is no room for loose parts to move from there intended place.

The reason all of these parts fall to pieces when the case is split by traditional method is that the primary shaft & shift cam are unbolted. This unbolted state allows the separation of the transmission pieces in a random way that causes everything to fall to pieces.

If however the right side pieces are all bolted in when the left side is pulled the transmission will stay locked in place. The drive axle cannot come loose as it is held to the right side because its gears are meshed to the primary shaft. The forks like wise cannot move as they are locked in place by the two shafts with meshed gears & the shift cam.

This locked in place state of the transmission parts is more then likely why it will not be possible to leave the parts on the right and swap only the drive axle with left case side off. The drive axle cannot come out when the primary shaft is bolted in. The shift forks cannot move when the transmission shafts are in place. More then likely what will occur should the parts stay on the right and the left case side is pulled away would be that the transmission would stay locked in place. What also may occur is the shift forks will stay in place but there rods will come apart randomly left to right causing the forks to fall loosely. Even with forks loose the drive shaft is still locked in place by the primary shaft.

This leaves the only likely short cut for this procedure to leave the crank and counter balancer bolted on, unbolt the primary shaft and shift cam, split the case and swap the output shaft. This leads the situation back to what you have already noted that its may work but just be such a hassle that a traditional case split method should be done to just keep things simple.

Transmission Parts


Shift Cam & Forks

[manco]

Transmission Parts


Shift Cam & Forks

-- Anhänge --
Anhang #1 (9138.jpg)
Anhang #2 (9139.jpg)